In Nigeria, there’s actually an insane/grifting preacher named Helen Ukpabio, who spreads a lot of fear-mongering about child witches. From her book: “If a child under the age of two screams in the night, cries and is always feverish with deteriorating health he or she is a servant of Satan.“ She’s basically built an entire “ministry” about this. Unfortunately, she’s not the only one
Poverty makes people anxious, and anxiety and fear makes for great motivators for making terrible decisions.
"I know witches don't seem real, but also I really cannot afford any bad luck right now. I want to help this child, but what if I do and I lose all my money? Or worse, my family gets put in danger? I can't risk it."
That becomes the thought process of all these people. Even education won't help if they don't have opportunities to earn money and feel secure.
Helen Ukpabio and evil assholes like her are known to send mobs to attack anyone who tries to help children accused of being witches or possessed by evil spirits too. So even if people don’t believe in any of it, there is a very real risk that they will be attacked for trying to help.
A lot of evil happens in the name of religion! People in poverty, they give away what little money they have, or retirees that give away the retirement to megachurch pastors. Religions that tell people they can pray away the gay….cause so many suicides.
People with schizophrenia that go down the religion rabbit hole and try to pray away the voices….
Church sex abuse. Holy wars. Crusades. Martyrdom. The entire Middle East. There’s good in religions too. But there’s good and evil everywhere, religions aren’t immune to evil.
It’s hard to tell if she genuinely believes these children are evil and she’s protecting society from them, and any money she makes off of it is just an added perk, or if she’s purely in it to cash in on a moral panic she helped stir up. It’s evil either way.
If people are showing kindness towards a child, people would see the witch as just a child, and her proclamation and authority would be undermined. The populations belief is all she has.
You’re all acting like we don’t have average Americans that attend churches in America that have hate preachers spouting this same stuff.
Maybe we don’t abandon babies, but this week one said a witch possessed Dump during the debate to make him do poorly and millions of Americans thought “sounds right!”
The only reason, ONLY reason half this country doesn't abandon or physically exploit their children for money is because of secular law telling them they'll serve jail time for doing so.
Poverty is a crime committed against people, forcing them into desperation to survive.
Desperate people do desperate things.
There’s a reason why terrorist organizations thrive best in illiterate and poor areas … poverty makes fertile breeding grounds for radicalization, if you can offer them anything better than the abject suffering their lives hold otherwise.
Also why gangs thrive in poor neighborhoods. Desperation, desire for more, lack of available routes to achieve it…
And, poverty and illiteracy allow grifters to pretend to be the hand of god and play roughshod over the innocents.
You know you brought up a good point, in Thailand I also notice that the most superstitious people are the poor and they would do anything to get a lucky break. Going to the extreme of believing that a sign that the super natural are trying to send you a sign or lottery numbers. They talk about lottery every other day and it is almost a social gathering to hear the lotto winning in the radio. When anything major bad happens, like a series of car accidents, they believe that it was something divine that was angry at them instead of a man made error in driving recklessly.
I don’t know. Given that there are now right wingers calling Harris a witch, I think it’s just crazy propaganda that’s not necessarily tied to poverty.
And people act like this is some underdeveloped world problem - but it's happening now, in the US, where we are supposedly educated. Look at Christianity and the LGBTQ community - there are libraries shutdown for containing a book with transpeople in it or childrens books where background characters have two moms or two dads. Disney boycotted for having gay characters.
All of it is based on 5 versus in the bible, which conveniently didn't even exist in the scripture prior to the 1940s. I mean, the Bibles oldest known language was Greek - there was no word for homosexual or gay in the Greek language at the time the Bible was written.
But let's pretend it was in there for a second. How many other things in the bible are much more prominent than sexuality or gender, but conveniently take a backseat because it's rampant in the Christian community. I don't see Christians out here protesting divorce or adultery like they do the gays. They sure as hell aren't trying to make divorce illegal or forcing people back to their first wife or husband.
This really isn't an intended bash on Christians, more a bash on Religion causing unnecessary pain when it's supposed to help people.
So, while the Old Testament definitely does disparage the gays even in the original Hebrew, it's still weird for Christians to adhere to that.
The entire point of Christianity is that the Old Testament rules are generally no longer in effect. Wanna eat shrimp or get a tattoo? No problem! But then when it's about gay people they're all "Leviticus this" and "Deuteronomy that".
The same way a nation/group/individual/community of people can believe things like slavery are fine. That treating a human worse than an animal is fine. Or treat animals inhumane bc they are "just" an animal.
Dehumanization, desensitization. People can justify any actions by adding "it's just..." OR by disconnecting themselves from the suffering of those "not like them".
Happens a lot in small and big ways. And it's heartbreaking.
But all religions started out more or less like this. A time where religion was greater than proof and facts because of things already mentioned here; poverty, lack of education, over-population. Religion being used to control its people.
Some places just haven't evolved much and therefore some subjects at these places are still stuck 100s if not 1000s of years back.
You're basically looking at kind of a medieval africa in modern age. It's heartwrenching.
I’ve never been a fan of the “Religion exists to control people” idea.
It’s not that I disagree with you even, I just don’t think it’s the primary reason for religion to exist, as it implies repeated conscious efforts to deceive people by political leadership. From an empirical perspective, a more parsimonious theory is that religion emerged to provide explanations for life, personal and social successes, the problem of evil, and tragedy. Also remedies to address all of these through ritual and doctrine.
The capacity to control people through religion arises from these cosmological explanations of life, and not the other way around. In a similar way, liberalism, communism, fascism, and other non-religious ideologies provide explanations of the world that go onto justify certain institutions, actions, and political decisions, and not vice versa. We have proof points of the latter from the fact that John Stuart Mills and Karl Marx posited their ideas before they had an opportunity to enact them.
That is not to say these explanations are right - religious or non-religious. In major ways, it’s a cope and a cop-out to blame the random tragedies of life on a child in Nigeria rather than accept that crap just happens sometimes.
Likewise, the idea that people came up with religion to comfort themselves over the death of a loved one is a far simpler and more likely theory to me than religion as something sent from on high, where the “on high” are the political class. Put all together, we invited religion in an attempt to exert control and explanation over our own lives.
All that is to say, I’ve found that talking to people about embracing the reality of random chance and the freedom that comes from not needing a human-derived explanation for everything.
It's "over there" so very few people and groups with a large enough platform to make a difference don't bother. And add that this is based on a very perverse form of evangelical Christianity even fewer would want to get involved less western Christians with a persecution complex take it personal.
People over here are out there saying to discipline infants because they "lie" and "manipulate" through crying. And yes, it's a religious thing. The parents/pastors will claim the infant does this because they were born with sin.
So it isn't necessarily an "over there" or educational problem, it's a warped religious one.
The Catholic Church has been saying since forever that witches don't exist. During all the witch trials in Europe and North America, the Catholic Church kept denouncing it and saying witchcraft isn't real. It was really just mob paranoia.
Cognitive dissonance people want to believe ministers have special godly insight/powers. And then wierd confirmation bias "like we have no witches it must be working". Throw ability also weaponize this against those that speak out. As a way to keep even the naysayers in check.
Honestly probrably biggest factor is that "desire" to believe. Like and it doesnt matter whether its religious stuff or political or social. Misinformation and propaganda spreads and sticks because that little trick peoples brain plays on them when they want something to be true.
These new hybrid models don't have the same gusto and don't get me started on the CyberSweeper. Made out of steel and has sharp edges. It makes for the worst ride.
My son used to get night terrors. He would seem awake and he would scream and cry and you could tell his was terrified of something, but he was never fully awake and never remembered it the next day. It was awful to watch and I can’t imagine someone seeing a kid doing that and just saying “must be a witch. He can fend for himself!”
Yeah it seems crazy to think that one would (first) jump to the conclusion that the kid is a witch, but also (second) that you'd then disown them for it. Like literally reject this little kid that can't fend for itself at all. It's pretty messed up. I'm glad that this little kid did find someone who could help, I just feel sorry for any others that weren't so lucky :/
When I was very young, I was in a cancer ward in a children's hospital here in Scotland. There was a two-year-old boy who had been dropped off at the ward by his parents, who then said they didn't want him anymore. The hospital had to get a court order to continue treating him because the parents refused to have anything to do with their son.
This little boy would try to get hugs from the parents of other kids. Sadly, his treatment didn't work.
My mum still cries about that boy. When he died, the other parents took turns to sit with him so he didn't die alone. At least he knew love and affection at the end.
I've been around lots of sick patients, old, young and kids, bad I was kinda used to it, we "acquire" this sort of shell around our feelings while dealing with other people and in some cases we even get relieved when some patients that had been suffering for too long finally die and get to "rest in peace".
now since my kid was born I changed so much, I lost my "shell" and became so soft for any history of any kid of parents suffering that I can't stop bawling may eyes out... but I don't see it as any kind of weakness, I just can't deal with the feelings of wanting that no child or parent ever has to suffer, and it doubles my resolution to do my job properly and give correct diagnosis for my patients.
It’s my son’s 2nd birthday today. He was so thrilled to get up today and put on his birthday shirt with spongebob and take cupcakes to his class. He has been asking to sing Happy Birthday at bedtime every night for the past week. He has not been the easiest toddler but he is a joy.
I too am bawling at work, but I’m sitting working at Panera so I’m just bawling at a table. I don’t have words for these people that do this.
He's clearly communicating with the spirit world. His soul held to his body by a thin tether by virtue of his pact with Satan/s
But seriously, that's how a lot of people used to see epilepsy and stuff like that, as either being able to be possessed by spirits or be able to leave the physical realm and enter their world. It shows up in various cultures through the world. Some of these people are then venerated or damned depending upon the specific culture and condition.
So my son also had them. It started around the time he was potty training. I would have never associated the two until my mom told me to take him to the toilet to pee cos that’s what causing the night terrors. Solved the problem! Not possessed by demons just needed to pee.
I have a 10 month old. I always tell my wife, it's not impossible that she is the actual antichrist. Time will tell. Hope she spare us or at least gives us a council position or something.
Someone should start cataloguing everything she does and make their own book about how all the things she does is devil work, and spread it around the country- but not name her directly.
Literally any toddler who gets a cold or flu or similar. If they are young enough they get very emotional because they don't know what's going on, they just know they feel bad, pukey, confused, etc... and just need care, sleep, and love.
Yeah they do. But this line of thinking isn't new. Pre-dark ages they said difficult babies were "changelings" that had been swapped for their real precious baby and they would leave them in the woods.
Basically rationalizing the murder of kids who were difficult because the parents couldn't take it anymore.
Don't hope for that. One of the traumatised children committing murder, and almost certainly paying a heavy penalty for it, would not be a happy ending.
Oh man. The first time my daughter slept through the night, she was 20 months old. My wife and I woke up to sunrise in a panic because every night for 20 months she would scream at least once a night. For the first six months we did shifts I was up with her until 2am and my wife from 2am til 8am. It was unreal how exhausting it was. I don’t remember much from that time except waking up in August on a Saturday in pure panic.
She such a sweet girl, and is ridiculously kind, and thoughtful. She won a Mr. Roger’s Award (creativity, kindness, and well-being toward schoolmates) at school last year, and I couldn’t be more proud. However, she’s turning 9 in a few months and getting her to get out of bed for school is the exact opposite 🤣 A good problem to have IMO.
The first time my daughter slept through the night, we couldn’t even wake her up. Until that night, the girl had eaten a meal every four hours for months. When both my wife and I woke up leisurely of our own accord, we looked at each other questioning, “Did you feed her this morning?”
Up in a panic, grab her from the portable crib (we were at a hotel). She wouldn’t wake up, so we panicked even more. Three minutes later, my wife and I are both dressed, getting ready to walk to a children’s hospital we discovered was two blocks from the hotel. As I go to grab my daughter, she opens her eyes, stretches and smiles, and looked at us like, “Cool. Where we going?”
She started sleeping through the night consistently after that.
Its so crazy. Had the same feeling the first time I used a baby carrier that you wrap around your chest (dont know the english word). My son didnt react cause he slept so tight. I panicked, put im out and on the couch and no reaction, so I pinched him in his leg till he woke up. Being a parent is crazy sometimes.
I had the same problem with my daughter. I was in a panic the first few nights after she started sleeping through the night. And then I spent 5 years recovering from the lack of sleep the prior 2 years. She's now a healthy 13 year old <3
My first daughter cried all the time. She would have been considered the spawn of Satan. It's beyond belief that someone would not have any empathy for this child and try to comfort him.
Oh that fucking bitch. She funded/appeared in a Nigerian film called “End of the Wicked” that’s all about witchcraft and how everything bad that happens in your life is because of witches. I loathe her
Maybe the child is screaming bc of hunger, thirst, malnutrition, being unclothed, being cast out by your family, etc. Just a thought. Stupid to label them a witch and have them scream even more. Kind of self fulfilling
I don’t have kids but any time someone mentions they have/had a colic-y baby makes my heart hurt. Idc if they won’t remember it, it’s just horrible to get a start on life like that.
A coworker told me one of her kids had it and they had to be fed a specific formula that was constantly flying off the shelves but she never took the last one unless she had no other options getting it somewhere else.
Holy shit, this bitch sent a mob to attack a meeting of human rights advocates, then tried to sue the government for letting law enforcement protect the group of human rights advocates from her mob. Just…wow.
From her book: “If a child under the age of two screams in the night, cries and is always feverish with deteriorating health he or she is a servant of Satan.“
Bruh. That's basically most kids <4 years old. What an evil mother fucker.
In Nigeria, there’s actually an insane/grifting preacher named Helen Ukpabio, who spreads a lot of fear-mongering about child witches. From her book: “If a child under the age of two screams in the night, cries and is always feverish with deteriorating health he or she is a servant of Satan.“ She’s basically built an entire “ministry” about this. Unfortunately, she’s not the only one
Not to get super political but have you seen how certain groups in the US are trying to repeal laws on things like child labor, freedom of speech, age of consent, etc?
We're all just one batshit insane dictator away from living in the middle ages.
I've read this as :"if you neglect your child and don't even want to provide the base amenities it needs, just toss it aside. nature will handle that issue for you eventually"
This basically describes every child teething, which happens on and off from like 6 months-2. My daughter will have a few days every few months where she just wakes up screaming because having a tooth go through your gums hurts!
I’m reading a book on the history of South Africa (The Covenant) and there’s a long history of shamans branding people as witches and villages either expelling them or outright killing them. Often, the families/children of the alleged witch were then viewed with suspicion by the rest of the village and ran the risk of also being branded as witches, or would choose to exile themselves. Something as simple as laughing while tending to their cattle could brand someone as a witch.
There was also a story about a Xhosa (apologies if that is no longer the correct term - the book was written in the 80s and I think it uses quite a few terms which are now considered derogatory) shaman and his niece who claimed to have seen visions of past warriors rising from the dead to unite with the Russians (who were supposed to be joining from the sea) in order to drive out the British and the Dutch/Afrikaners. The only stipulation was that all of the Xhosa had to burn their crops/food and kill all their cattle. Thousands starved to death because a little girl saw a vision in a pool of water.
Religion truly poisons everything. It only brings judgement and suffering and fear and hatred and feelings of supremacy to the many and power to the few.
There is not a single positive thing that religion brings that is unique to itself. Anything positive that is said to come from religion can instead be obtained through secular means.
I actually worked for awhile in NGOs implementing programs to help with stuff like this
It seems insane to us but consider how in some places literacy is less then 50 percent and those that can read can only barely read. Education is extremely poor as well so a population can easily be influenced
There is a threshold at which we must stop allowing the excuses of propaganda, brainwashing, lack of critical thinking ability, and such. At some point, no matter how someone manipulated you, you must be accountable for behaving a thousand years behind the times.
Most kids (correct me if im wrong) develop teeth at that age and it’s a painful process that can cause fevers… so basically every average kid is a witch
I think it’s also important to add that by accusing a child of being a witch, you can stop feeding and taking care of the child in a socially accepted way. Many of the families who do this are in extreme poverty. There is a deeper societal function to this other than “ignorance/religion”.
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u/Nerevarine91 5d ago edited 5d ago
In Nigeria, there’s actually an insane/grifting preacher named Helen Ukpabio, who spreads a lot of fear-mongering about child witches. From her book: “If a child under the age of two screams in the night, cries and is always feverish with deteriorating health he or she is a servant of Satan.“ She’s basically built an entire “ministry” about this. Unfortunately, she’s not the only one