I totally get his frustration with frogan and I’ll even go as far as to say hasan shouldve said something to her by now if he hasn’t but I still don’t understand what getting both fanbases involved helps with
edit: not disagreeing with you, just expanding on what you said.
hasan has made the clear statement that he will not censor his mods or his editors. thats just what it is, i understand disagreeing with this on principle but from a leftist perspective, if hasan would start telling people who work for him what they can or cant say that would be a bit of a problem. the only step he could take is fire her as a mod and i think that is too drastic. he may or may not have asked her to tone it down behind the scenes but i doubt that as well, hasan isnt known for tone policing marginalized people.
at the end of the day, frogan is her own person. the mindset that hasan should tell her what not to say comes from a hierarchical idea of worker-employer relationships which hasan does not subscribe to.
edit: and i hate to say it but this hierarchical mindset of censoring people who work for you is kind of what makes ethan an easy target of that attack in a way too. he demands that hasan censor his mod because in ethans eyes thats a valid request. so now people think that ethan might censor his own employees as well which is an accusation he frequently deals with. again im not saying i do or dont think that. im just pointing out a dynamic im witnessing, i personally dont think we have enough information that would indicate ethan does that at all. especially since they do sometimes disagree with him
I think Hasan is particularly sensitive about Frogan and he would totally censor most of his other mods if they acted like Frogan, but because Frogan is Frogan and always acting out, the bar is on the floor for his mods.
The reason I think he is sensitive about it is because him and Frogan have actually very much had arguments in the past about religion, and I think he is sensitive to her plight as a Muslim woman so essentially refuses to do anything about her.
I think if Ethan's employees were instigating an online feud with a friend of the show and saying half the nonsense Frogan does, they would be talked to about ruining show relationships and being unprofessional.
She's his mod, gets invited on his streams, she represents his community.
He's argued many other times that streamers have a responsibility in shaping their communities according to their values, then suddenly he abdicates all responsibility and capability to moderate his own community when they attack Ethan and Hila.
… have you ever had an employer? You can coach your employees, how is that unethical? That’s pretty ridiculous to say considering he is a brand and her acting out the way she is , someone who is an ambassador of his brand in an extent, just because you’re leftist doesn’t mean you don’t abide by any standards. I find this type of thinking to be very juvenile
Edit: oh ya.. I forgot about hasans unique utopian environment my b, so having any rules is against the rules
you simply have a different fundamental mindset from what the left thinks about this. imo theres no point in arguing about this cause we just disagree. and so i wont argue. but yes, ive had many employers and ive also worked and know leftist co-ops. its just two fundamentally different way of doing things, no need to argue about it
usually a discussion isnt had in such a contentious tone (plus sarcasm as well there in the edit) but that might just be my personal experience. maybe someone else will take you up on it though
I'm pretty sure your leftist coop would kick you out if you starting doing apologist stuff for a known terrorist who wanted gay people dead and women locked in their home with no rights.
Leftists generally like gay rights and women's rights. Being like well, let's do some "analysis" on people who want you to die, is not the take people think it is.
This isn't deep academia where people are actually reading a multiple page analysis that would also cover Osama's bigotry and actually have a proper analysis. This twitter "analysis" is an excuse to downplay and whitewash hatred against women and LGBTQ folks, hand waving it away when bringing it up makes it look like it's okay. It's not hard to be like "yes and that's awful" instead of trying to spin that bringing it up is actually the bad thing or whatever.
None of these people are smart enough to do analysis. Like not even as an insult really, just none of them are actually presenting any analysis based on any level of education any person should respect. It's a shitty opinion being disguised as intelligent when it's not.
If you are going to let your mods represent your community however they want then you shouldn’t hire toxic mods that will shit talk your friends. His loss.
leftist workplace dynamics can be new and confusing cause we are used to a totally different way of seeing it. so i understand that it isnt obvious to most people and maybe not even seen as valid by some people. theres lots to argue about lol
I’m still newish to leftist politics but I’m always surprised by learning things like this cause I think “yeah we should have a boss that respects everyone’s human rights” about something I never even blinked twice about before
the first step is to question every hierarchy/power imbalance lol. but yea we are steeped in a capitalist mindset since birth, its hard to undo that. hopefully at some point there will be more leftist workplaces in the world and it will be more normalized but who knows
I mean I get where Hasan is coming from sort of, but tbf there’s a difference between censoring your mod and telling them to not be a fucking asshole and shit talk someone online
It’s not censoring to be like “hey Ethan gets a bit mad when you insult him maybe don’t poke the fucking bear and stop mentioning him on twitter?”
Like I said It’s less of a legal thing and more of a “hey don’t be a fucking asshole” type of thing.
Like yeah you have the right to freedom of speech or whatever but that doesn’t mean using it to be petty online is morally correct even if you’re legally allowed to
I do agree that Ethan should be focusing on frogan less but at the same time she just had to add in her 2 cents like the clout chaser she is and I think a lot of people here are rightfully annoyed by her shenanigans and antics considering the past
I mean Ethan was arguing with people online too. That’s what I don’t get, he’s exhibiting the same behavior the only difference is Ethan expects Hasan to punish Frogan for her opinion. It’s not clout chasing to disagree with someone online to me. It does feel clout chasing or views chasing to drag someone who’s tried to protect you into it tho. I won’t comment on their personal relationship but from a content POV this is such a bad look for Ethan.
It seems so childish for a grown man to be engaging in general. Is he also going to demand that his staff not be friends with her if Hasan isn’t allowed to let her be a mod?
He could make a public statement saying he disagrees with what she says or her actions, but that he doesnt control her or own her opinions. BUT, if he does agree with her that becomes something else entirely.
If he chatted with Hasan privately and nothing changed, the next step is to make it public and hope outside pressure will cause a change. Makes sense to me.
Well the difference is the H3 community understands Israel Is committing a genocide in Palestine whereas Frogan/Hasans community are deliberately painting him and Hila as a zionist, murderous fucking freaks all over the internet. I mean how else does a Man defend himself from being portrayed as something he isn't.
Hasan didn't really do it so Ethan has to instead.
Then, again this should be Ethan pestering hasan privately to get his community in order. the people harassing him are either hasan mods or weird twitter people all of which Ethan as a public figure has had to deal with all his life. I get it’s heinous to call someone such horrible things but Ethan (not to be too frank here) should be used to it as a public figure. He’s a multimillionaire badass that shouldn’t need to defend himself against (sorry again to be frank here) nobodies on twitter. His fanbase and most other people know he isn’t an extreme Zionist and the people I’ve met that do often just have a slight misunderstanding bc of their actual ties to Isreal like Hila’s mandatory service or him living there. Either way they’re usually easily explained out of it in person.
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u/gwoolman50 6d ago
I totally get his frustration with frogan and I’ll even go as far as to say hasan shouldve said something to her by now if he hasn’t but I still don’t understand what getting both fanbases involved helps with